Date: Wed, Feb 21, 2001 at 00:02:37 (GMT) From: Joe Email: None To: Connie Subject: Connie..... Message:

Are you from the Midwest? Ever live in the Chicago ashram? You sound like somebody I used to know.

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Date: Wed, Feb 21, 2001 at 01:49:04 (GMT) From: Connie Email: None To: Joe Subject: Connie..... Message:

Dear Joe I am not from USA. At present I would like to be just someone trying to sort it all out. Respectfully C (My name is a joke - a play on being conned)

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Date: Wed, Feb 21, 2001 at 01:56:37 (GMT) From: Joe Email: None To: Connie Subject: Okay.....just wondered (nt) Message:

nt

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Date: Tues, Feb 20, 2001 at 18:55:28 (GMT) From: G Email: None To: Connie Subject: Great post Message:

'The decision was that I had been living in la-la land, and the change I was so desperately hoping for would never come. That the cultish behaviour I saw and hated for years was not because of what I thought the premies had made it, but in reality that is what it was, a cult, and in the name of that cult, anything that represented it or Maharaji in a bad light was excusable and hidden. I also had to accept that Maharaji had and has total responsiblity.' I too was hoping for a change for years. I finally gave up and I'm glad I did. The concept that it is the premies that make it a cult comes from Rawat (aka 'Maharaji'). He uses this concept as part of his scheme. I remember him talking about 'premie paranoia', but he instilled this paranoia in premies in the first place with all his talk of how dark the world is and stuff like 'I'm the only one who cares about you.' This concept is still being used, at www.elanvital.com, he claims that he claims to be an ordinary person, but that he's treated with adulation. There seems to be two hidden contradictory meanings. One is that he really isn't ordinary; that he's just being humble. The other is that he is ordinary but it's just his followers that are wacko, that it isn't his fault that they idolize him. Here, people are asked to 'excuse' premies' behavior and go along with the idea that he has nothing to do with it, even though he is their 'Master'. If it walks like a duck ...

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Date: Wed, Feb 21, 2001 at 01:29:55 (GMT) From: Connie Email: None To: G Subject: Great post Message:

'This concept is still being used, at www.elanvital.com, he claims that he claims to be an ordinary person, but that he's treated with adulation. There seems to be two hidden contradictory meanings. One is that he really isn't ordinary; that he's just being humble. The other is that he is ordinary but it's just his followers that are wacko, that it isn't his fault that they idolize him. Here, people are asked to 'excuse' premies' behavior and go along with the idea that he has nothing to do with it, even though he is their 'Master'.' Ah yes, this is what I believe is the crux of it, and it is one of the things I have been giving a lot of thought to. My involvement and investment was based on one belief, that indeed he was no ordinary person, and as such, deserved the best I could give, at whatever personal cost. I did this willingly. The question I have asked of myself and would ask of those involved in whatever way they are is (leaving the 'I am a filament' example aside for a moment): Exactly who and what is Maharji to me? (i.e. What is my core belief about him). Other questions/things that related to this for me: Why is he treated with such fawning, reverence, timidity and sadly, desperation, with monumental effort made not to cause him any discomfort on any level. This is what he expects. There is a word I have heard down the years often amongst those with knowledge, and it is still used today, in direct relation to him, 'Precious'. That seems to suggest something pretty grand. To put it plainly, if he is not thought of as God, greater than God or whatever, why on earth is he treated like he is, and if he does not believe it himself why does he expect that kind of treatment. Why do people put up with situations that are often physically, financially, mentally and emotionally taxing if they do not believe this. Why is his behaviour excused and hidden. If these things were done by someone considered ordinary, would there be so much latitude given. Why is it that another set of rules seem to be applied to him in comparison to the entire human race. Actions do speak louder than words, and this is where there is a huge contradiction. The words being used today, to the general population and within the organization are totally at odds with how people with knowledge are acting. I eventually saw operating in such an environment was creating a very unhealthy split in me. At the core of myself there was a very smug, arrogant, secretive attitude, I was totally unaware that I was operating from. What a fright! How did Elan Vital and those by association get so deceptive? When addressing these things in myself, I tried not to use that vague premie abstraction that is used to define most things. I forced myself to really think and feel from my gut level. This was like wading through some thick syrupy mixture. There has been some talk on the forum of what is called 'knowledge lite' people. From my observation not many people in the west are interested, and if they do take knowledge, hardly anyone stays around. Attrition is fast and high...... Boy, once you start it's hard to stop...

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Date: Wed, Feb 21, 2001 at 03:38:40 (GMT) From: Pat Conlon Email: None To: Connie Subject: Thanks, Connie, ex-PWK Message:

I just really appreciate your quiet sane voice. I just left the urug last New Year's Eve and have been having a lot of fun here on FV. There's a lot of stuff going on but a lot of real truth is spoken here to. There's also quite a bit of hostile reaction to that ''preciousness'' that permeates PWK-dom. It's jsy a bit of harmless bitterness and acidity and saltiness to counteract the sweet cloyingness of premie preciosity. Good for you having the courage to break away from such silly teacher. I still meditate and enjoy it and have found the ''Indian Background'' Links on EPO a great help to claim it for myself and not as a ''gift'' from Rev Rawat for which I was supposed to show my ''gratitude'' with monthly donations. And I am enjoying it all so much more without all the ''concepts'' (such as THE ''Master'') that Rev Rawat was shoving down my throat. I feel nice and clean for a change. Have fun and feel your own strength coursing through you.

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Date: Tues, Feb 20, 2001 at 16:32:56 (GMT) From: Susan Email: None To: Connie Subject: wow Message:

thanks Connie, again I am very touched by your words. Another thing that Rawat says that I think is ironic is the 'listen to your heart' I think that listening to my heart was what got me out so many years ago. I am so happy to read you are listening to yours! Susan

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Date: Tues, Feb 20, 2001 at 11:24:06 (GMT) From: Marianne Email: delores@gofree.indigo.ie To: Connie Subject: Excellent post, Connie Message:

Connie: Thank you so much for telling us that it was the disclosures about the Jagdeo sexual abuse, and the cult's and premies' response to it, that helped you to leave the cult. I am certain that Susan and Abi will both be very touched that they were responsible for helping you to leave the cult behind. It was very difficult for Susan and Abi to make this information public. When we exes read posts like yours, we once again applaud their courageousness in posting these horrifying stories, because it exposes the cult for what it is at the highest echelons. Capt. Rawat has turned the concept of 'truth' on its head in the world of the cult. The truth he told us to aspire to was supposed to bring peace into our hearts and lives. But when that same mirror of truth is applied to him, he asks that we abandon all logical reasoning and not judge him by the same rules, or not judge him at all. Why? Because, as you pointed out, he abjectly fails any accountability or responsibility test, in the way he behaves in his personal life and with his followers. The $800 Amaroo line the pockets of Capt. Rawat gift tax is just the latest example of his unmitigated greed. I hope you will write your journey, Connie. Thanks for making this post. Marianne

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Date: Wed, Feb 21, 2001 at 08:06:54 (GMT) From: Connie Email: None To: Marianne Subject: Excellent post, Connie Message:

Dear Marianne Maybe this is splitting hairs, but I would not say exactly that it helped me leave the cult. What it did was enable me to see that I was in a cult, I believe an important distinction. Once realizing that fact, it allowed me to exercise choice in whether I wanted to be in a cult. Before that realization I did not have the freedom to choose. For that I am very thankful, which contributed to my decision to post. Perhaps this is what first has to be recognized, before people can leave. C

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